[Mristudio-users] program crashes

Anuar Imanbayev aimanba1 at jhu.edu
Tue May 19 12:20:29 EDT 2009


Eric, 

If you're still having trouble with these Siemens files and they happen to be Mosaic files,

I created a handy protocol on how to deal with these Siemens Mosaic files in DTI. There are just some adjustments to be made, that's all.

Good luck,
Anuar

----- Original Message -----
From: Hangyi Jiang <hjiang at jhmi.edu>
Date: Tuesday, May 5, 2009 11:04 am
Subject: Re: [Mristudio-users] program crashes
To: mristudio-users at mristudio.org


> mostly, this happens when the number of images doesn't match with that
>  of gradients specified in the gradeint table.
>  when the dataset was successfully being loaded in,  the image volumes
>  will be listed in the "Image List" of the "image" tab.  please view
>  these images, make sure the # of images are same as the # of items in
>  the gradient table.
>  
>  another common mistake for Siemens dataset is that the images are Masaic
>  format but they were loaded in as DICOM format.
>  
>  regards,
>  
>  hangyi
>   
>  
>  
>  >>> eric Q <qcdunk at hotmail.com> 05/05/09 2:05 AM >>>
>  
>  Hi Susumu:
>  
>  Thank you for answering my question regarding the gradient table.
>  However the program crashes every time when I try to do a calculation
>  (DTI mapping). I've tried to calculate Tensor, Color map, ADC map, Mean,
>  but I always get this "The mriView3D MFC application has encountered 
> a
>  problem and needs to close".
>  
>  
>  I am a new user to DTI studio, so there are probably a lot of mistakes
>  I've made on my end, but could you please tell me what are the likely
>  causes for the crash of my program? Your time and help is much
>  appreciated.
>  
>  Regards
>  
>  Eric Q
>  
>  Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 09:32:56 -0400
>  From: susumu at mri.jhu.edu
>  To: mristudio-users at mristudio.org
>  Subject: Re: [Mristudio-users] Gradient table
>  
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>  
>  
>  Hi Liang,
>  
>   
>  
>  1)      I
>  am not sure which coordinates (space) the ultimate gradient table was
>  relative
>  to, such as frequency- and phase-encoding of image, horizontal and
>  vertical
>  direction of image, or magnets' x/y/z coordinates. Based on your reply,
>  I think
>  that it might be the last one.
>  
>  When you present vectors, color maps, or performing
>  fiber tracking, X, Y, and Z need to be defined by the image matrix. This
>  is the
>  most natural way. The frequency/phase/slice and image x/y/z have
>  permutation
>  relationship, like frequency – image x / phase – image y / slice –
>  image z or frequency – image y / phase – image x / slice – image
>  z.
>  
>  The relationship between magnet x / y / z and image x
>  / y / z could have oblique relationship if oblique scan is used, and
>  therefore
>  could be very complicated.
>  
>  The gradient table, ultimately, needs to adopt the
>  image x / y / z system. Now most vendor system is adopting a way to
>  deliver
>  gradient application in the frequency/phase/slice system, moving away
>  from
>  gradient x/y/z. This means, when oblique scan is employed, the scanner
>  dynamically recalculates the gradient table in the f/p/s coordinates. 
> If
>  the
>  scanner doesn’t do this (like old Siemens system), we have to
>  recalculate
>  the table based on the oblique angles by ourselves. The former is more
>  fool-proof.
>  
>  
>  
>  2) In my *.PAR file, there was last 3 columns representing diffusion
>  directions
>  but obviously different between subjects. I don't know what diffusion
>  were
>  recorded in this header file.
>  
>  I don’t have much experience with the new PAR
>  file, but if you are using oblique scans, it is not surprising the each
>  patient
>  have different gradient table in the “magnet” coordinate. Suppose
>  we want to apply [1, 0, 0] in the first line of the gradient table,
>  which is the
>  “X” orientation. If we use an oblique scan, magnet X and image X
>  are no longer the same. As I mentioned above, in the end, what we want
>  to know
>  is gradient orientation in the image coordinate. So we have two choices.
>  
>  
>  Choice 1: deliver magnet [1, 0, 0], meaning pure X
>  gradient application. This X gradient could be something like [0.9,
>  0.15, 0] in
>  the image coordinate. We need to do [1, 0, 0] x ImageRotation to get 
> new
>  gradient table to do tensor calculation.
>  
>  Choice 2: deliver magnet [0.9, -0.15, 0] (I just made
>  up these numbers) so that the applied gradient aligns the image X axis.
>  In this
>  case, we can use gradient table [1, 0, 0] for tensor calculation.
>  
>   
>  
>  I hope this makes your questions answered.
>  
>  Susumu
>  
>   
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  From:
>  mristudio-users-bounces at mristudio.org
>  [ On Behalf Of liang wang
>  
>  Sent: Saturday, AprI also have a similar question about gradient 
> tables in Philips scanner.
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  My data were collected using following protocols:
>  
>  1) Gradient table: Medium
>  
>  2) Gradient overplus: no
>  
>  3) Oblique plane: yes, and different angles between subjects.
>  
>  
>  
>  Looking through your answer, I know that this set can result in the same
>  gradient table input into DTIstudio for all subject. However, 1) I am
>  not sure
>  which coordinates (space) the ultimate gradient table was relative to,
>  such as
>  frequency- and phase-encoding of image, horizontal and vertical
>  direction of
>  image, or magnets' x/y/z coordinates. Based on your reply, I think that
>  it
>  might be the last one.
>  
>  
>  
>  2) In my *.PAR file, there was last 3 columns representing diffusion
>  directions
>  but obviously different between subjects. I don't know what diffusion
>  were
>  recorded in this header file.
>  
>  
>  
>  Many thanks
>  
>  
>  
>  Liang
>  
>  
>  
>  2009/4/16 susumu <susumu at mri.jhu.edu>
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  Hi Eric,
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  For Philips scanner there are several types of gradient
>  tables you can specify in the scanner. Please check your protocol for
>  the
>  following points;
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  1)       Gradient table: High (32-orientation)/ Medium (15-orientation)
>  /
>  Low (6-orientation)
>  
>  2)       Overplus (ON / OFF)
>  
>  3)       Oblique plane (X/Y/Z angles)
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  The first option has 3 choices and the second option has 2
>  choices. Therefore, there are 3 x 2 = 6 gradient tables.
>  
>  
>  If the second option (Overplus) is NO, the third option has
>  no effect. If the second option is YES, the gradient table has to be
>  rotated
>  based on the oblique angles.
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  To simplify the DTI processing, we recommend Overplus = NO.
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  We have the basic 6 tables, which can be used as is if you
>  use Overplus = OFF or Oblique angles = 0/0/0 degree.
>  
>  
>  Please let us know which options you are using.
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  Susumu
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  From: mristudio-users-bounces at mristudio.org
>  [
>  On Behalf Of eric Q
>  
>  Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2009
>  9:44 PM
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  To: mristudio-users at mristudio.org
>  
>  
>  
>  Subject: Re:
>  [Mristudio-users] Gradient table
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  Hello Dear DTIstudio users:
>  
>  
>  
>  I am new to DTIstudio, I was hoping someone could give me some much
>  needed
>  advises for beginners.
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  I was trying to obtain the FA values for my brain phantom (PHILIP 3T
>  scanner).
>  When I clicked on "DTI mapping", it prompted me to enter the
>  "gradient table", how do I calculate the "gradient table"?
>  
>  
>  
>  Thanks in advanced
>  
>  
>  
>  Best regards
>  
>  
>  
>  Eric
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  Date: Thu, 9 Apr 2009 11:04:09
>  -0400
>  
>  From: susumu at mri.jhu.edu
>  
>  To: mristudio-users at mristudio.org
>  
>  Subject: Re: [Mristudio-users] MriView3D application close
>  
>  Hi Hugh,
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  When you got this error, please suspect one of the following
>  two reasons;
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  1) Memory shortage:
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  Even if you have many GB of memories, 32-bit Windows system
>  can allocate only 1 - 1.5 GB to each program. To check if you have the
>  memory
>  problem, please restrict the slices to be calculated. In the
>  initial data parameter window, there is a section called "Slices to
>  be processed". Here you can specify only a portion of slices to be
>  processed. Please limit the slices to, for example, 0-9 and see how it
>  goes. If
>  you can calculate tensors without errors, then you have the memory
>  problem. The
>  solution is; a) upgrade to the 64-bit system or b) devide the
>  calculation to 2
>  batches (e.g. slice 0-29 for the first batch and 30-59 for the second
>  batch),
>  calculate all maps (e.g. FA), and later combine them.
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  2) Mismatch between the gradient table and the number of
>  images:
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  For example, if you specify 12-orientation table and 30
>  volume images, then you get the error. After loading the data and before
>  you go
>  to the Dti Map tab, make sure that you have 1 b0 + 64 DWIs in the
>  pull-down
>  menu in the right column of the Image tab. If you have the correct
>  number of
>  the images, then you might have an error in your gradient 
> tab"DtiMapping" in the "File" button again, d) the window still
>  remembers the gradient table you entered last time. This remembered
>  window
>  tells how DtiStudio interpreted your gradient table. If there is any
>  syntax
>  errors, you may find them much easier. For example, if you enter, "4: 
> 1
>  0.5 0", instead of "4: 1, 0.5, 0", then you would find, "4:
>  1, 0, 0".
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  If any of these do not solve the issue, please let us know.
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  Susumu
>  
>  
>   
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  From: mristudio-users-bounces at mristudio.org
>  [
>  On Behalf Of Hugh Wang
>  
>  Sent: Wednesday, April 08, 2009
>  6:30 PM
>  
>  To: mristudio-users at mristudio.org
>  
>  Subject: [Mristudio-users]
>  MriView3D application close
>  
>  Hi, 
>  
>  
>  
>  I was using the dtistudio (ver. 2.4)  to look at the Siemens DICOM
>  diffusion images (1baseline,64 gradients). After successfully loading
>  the
>  images, I click the "dti map" option at lower right corner. Whatever
>  calculation I choose, it always gives me an error: 
>  
>  
>  
>  "MriView3D MFC Application has encountered a problem and needs to
>  close.  We are sorry for the inconvenience."
>  
>  
>  
>  I tried several PCs, and the problem keeped the same. I would appreciate
>  that
>  if there's anyone having any idea on how to solve it. Thanks.
>  
>  
>  Best,
>  
>  Hugh
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
>  
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>  -- 
>  
>  Liang Wang, PhD
>  
>  Postdoctoral Fellow
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